DISCUSS: Joseph Andrew Stack Manifesto Transcript?

I have to be honest. I'm not normally given to displays of emotion. But I was weeping by the time I finished with this.

Because Joe Stack is me. Not just me. But people like me.

People who every day wake up and feel that the world has played a very, very, very bad, very ill-tasting joke on them. These are the very same people who have built every single country in this history of Planet Earth. The very same people who are beaten down, day after day, engaged in unfair trade with their employers.

The very people who drown in debt they have no way of repaying, working day after day after day, 8 hours, 12 hours, 16 hours, 24 hours, sometimes even 36 hours at a time. This is not a new concept, either, this merciless destruction of the tired, the poor, the huddled masses, yearning to breathe free, but only managing to breathe the carcinogens of factory smoke. In ancient Sparta, the nobility declared a merciless annual war against the Helots, their own peasantry, to bludgeon them into submission so abject that they would never even dare to dream that things might ever be different.In the middle ages, the serf was little more than a slave.

Now, the serf...worker, that is, is a wage-slave, still bound to their jobs, bound to their tiny paychecks, wishing that somehow things could be different, yet knowing that they will not be. Ever."Why is it that a handful of thugs and plunderers can commit unthinkable atrocities (and in the case of the GM executives, for scores of years) and when itâ€™s time for their gravy train to crash under the weight of their gluttony and overwhelming stupidity, the force of the full federal government has no difficulty coming to their aid within days if not hours? Yet at the same time, the joke we call the American medical system, including the drug and insurance companies, are murdering tens of thousands of people a year and stealing from the corpses and victims they cripple, and this countryâ€™s leaders donâ€™t see this as important as bailing out a few of their vile, rich cronies.

Yet, the political â€œrepresentativesâ€ (thieves, liars, and self-serving scumbags is far more accurate) have endless time to sit around for year after year and debate the state of the â€œterrible health care problemâ€. Itâ€™s clear they see no crisis as long as the dead people donâ€™t get in the way of their corporate profits rolling in. " Yes.

Why is it that our lives are worth so little to the people we elect that they'll gleefully watch us burn while they light their cigars on our pyres? Why is it that our CEO's and our dear, dear politicians wish so desperately to see us perish? What answer can anyone give that will satisfy the demands of basic human DECENCY?!

Have they forgotten how to be human? Have they somehow evolved into Morlocks? It would seem so, yet if they were Morlocks, wouldn't that make us the Eloi, living our charmed lives above the surface, just like the characters from H.G.Wells' "The Time Machine"?No.

Because we DON'T live charmed lives. We're fed garbage that is designed to kill us. Everyone knows it.

But who has a will strong enough to resist? Often, we participate in this nightmare because we feel we have no choice. This is the only reality we know now.

And if this is the logical conclusion of history, then I pray for a comet to come and end it all.(nothing personal to anyone there. I don't wish death on anyone, but if this continual war against one's own people is the way it will be forever, then our lives mean nothing anyway.) "And justice? Youâ€™ve got to be kidding!

How can any rational individual explain that white elephant conundrum in the middle of our tax system and, indeed, our entire legal system? Here we have a system that is, by far, too complicated for the brightest of the master scholars to understand. Yet, it mercilessly â€œholds accountableâ€ its victims, claiming that theyâ€™re responsible for fully complying with laws not even the experts understand.

The law â€œrequiresâ€ a signature on the bottom of a tax filing; yet no one can say truthfully that they understand what they are signing; if thatâ€™s not â€œduressâ€ than what is. If this is not the measure of a totalitarian regime, nothing is. " Just in case anyone holds on to the delusion that this is a land of freedom and justice and conscience and liberty, just like the propaganda says, I ask where is paradise for people like "The West Memphis Three"?

Where is justice for them? They're sitting on Death Row right now. Because they were metal-heads.

Where is paradise for them? Where is paradise for Leonard Peltier, who was illegally extradited from Canada, thrown into prison as a political prisoner, and denied the chance of ever again being a free man? Where was paradise for Sacco and Vanzetti, who were executed just because they were Anarchists?

Where is the justice for these people? Where is the justice for the people who spent years in the pen for selling drugs to feed their children, because our wonderful system couldn't provide them the basic necessities they needed to feed, shelter, clothe, educate, and nurture their families? What answer can the powers-that-be give for this?

Perhaps they've grown so arrogant, they feel they don't NEED to answer. Maybe they rest upon the law as if the law is its own justification. WRONG!

"My introduction to the real American nightmare starts back in the early â€˜80s. Unfortunately after more than 16 years of school, somewhere along the line I picked up the absurd, pompous notion that I could read and understand plain English. Some friends introduced me to a group of people who were having â€˜tax codeâ€™ readings and discussions.

In particular, zeroed in on a section relating to the wonderful â€œexemptionsâ€ that make institutions like the vulgar, corrupt Catholic Church so incredibly wealthy. We carefully studied the law (with the help of some of the â€œbestâ€, high-paid, experienced tax lawyers in the business), and then began to do exactly what the â€œbig boysâ€ were doing (except that we werenâ€™t steeling from our congregation or lying to the government about our massive profits in the name of God). We took a great deal of care to make it all visible, following all of the rules, exactly the way the law said it was to be done.

The intent of this exercise and our efforts was to bring about a much-needed re-evaluation of the laws that allow the monsters of organized religion to make such a mockery of people who earn an honest living. However, this is where I learned that there are two â€œinterpretationsâ€ for every law; one for the very rich, and one for the rest of usâ€¦ Oh, and the monsters are the very ones making and enforcing the laws; the inquisition is still alive and well today in this country. " And Churches do not have to contribute anything material to society.

This is a rule which has endured for centuries. Why? When the Roman Catholic Church alone has enough money to feed the entire world for months, why are they not following the freaking MESSAGE that Jesus Christ, the founder of their entire religion, put forth.

Feeding the many? Yeah, that was a Jesus thing (whether or not one believes the stories is immaterial. The whole point is in the message, a message which many if not all religions seems to have lost track of over the centuries).

Funny how it was a Jesus thing. But not a Pope thing. But I'm not singling out the Popes here.

Because every single leader of every single religion in the world has failed in the same way, failed to see to the needs of their flocks. But people continue to flock to them. Because, much like convicts, we're institutionalized to believe that this is the only way.

And this double standard, these different sets of rules for the rich and the poor, to that I say, how dare they? But louder than that, I scream, "How dare WE?! " For you see, we get exactly what we deserve.

Because WE let this happen. I did. You did.

We all did. Our parents did. Our grandparents did.

Their parents did, and so on into the dim mists of antiquity. All because we didn't have the courage to stand up for ourselves. There are 300 million Americans, give or take.

How many of those Americans are there in all three branches of government? I'm willing to bet that the answer to that does not fall in the "millions" category. How is it that thousands are able to control MILLIONS?!

Because we let them. Every 4 years. Now I know what you're saying.

"What do you want ME to do? I'm just one person. I can't make a difference.

What's the point in sacrificing my T-Bone steaks, and my playstations, and my fancy car, and my "good" job, for the uncertainty of a Revolution which probably will be squelched at its very inception? " The answer to this is that YOU can't do anything.By yourself, anyways. Each and every one of us, as an individual, is powerless.

But consider if only 10% of the total population of the U.S. Decided to take up arms and march on Washington? That's upwards of 30 million people. What can 30 million people do?

Well, they can do a lot more than 1 can.It has saddened me greatly throughout my life whenever I thought of examples like the Kent State incident, where 4 American citizens, college students, were gunned down by their own countrymen, National Guardsmen. Where was the revolution then? There was none.

Instead it was "Well, they killed four of us. They're not playing around. I guess we'd better join the system and try to make as much money as we can."

Welcome to the '80's, the "Me" Decade. And if you're looking for the genesis of all the woes you're suffering right now, the '80's is a good place to start looking. Rather than let the deaths of those four American citizens COUNT for something, rather than let that incident be the catalyst for a popular revolution to overthrow Capitalism and establish Direct Democracy, they just gave up.

Just like we give up. We sit there and watch Iraq and Afghanistan coverage on cable news, and we shake our heads, and say "That's a terrible shame. We shouldn't be over there."

But do we do anything to stop it? Well, here's something I'm doing to stop it. It may not accomplish much, but at least I'm trying.To all citizens of the United States and to all servicemen and servicewomen serving here and abroad, I have this to say: IF YOU HAVE NOT JOINED THE ARMED FORCES, DON'T.

IF YOU HAVE JOINED THE ARMED FORCES, MUTINY. REFUSE TO FIGHT. I AM AWARE THIS STATEMENT WALKS THE LINE OF TREASON, AND I MAKE THIS STATEMENT ON MY OWN.

NEITHER MAHALO. COM NOR ANYONE ELSE ON THIS PLANET IS PARTY TO THIS STATEMENT. BUT YES, I ADVISE YOU TO MUTINY, BECAUSE YOUR LIVES ARE WORTH MORE TO ME THAN THEY ARE TO YOUR OWN GOVERNMENT!

"The significance of independence, however, came much later during my early years of college; at the age of 18 or 19 when I was living on my own as student in an apartment in Harrisburg, Pennsylvania. My neighbor was an elderly retired woman (80+ seemed ancient to me at that age) who was the widowed wife of a retired steel worker. Her husband had worked all his life in the steel mills of central Pennsylvania with promises from big business and the union that, for his 30 years of service, he would have a pension and medical care to look forward to in his retirement.

Instead he was one of the thousands who got nothing because the incompetent mill management and corrupt union (not to mention the government) raided their pension funds and stole their retirement. All she had was social security to live on." The paragraph I just cited is exactly the point at which I started to cry.

Because that old lady described in that paragraph might as well be my own Mother. My Mother was a musical genius. She was composing music at age 3.

She passed up a chance to go to Juliard so that she could raise a family. Since she was a single mother with 3 kids, she went to work, naturally, at a place that seemed to pay a decent wage. Bethelhem Steel, Burns Harbor.

She worked there for 30 years, performing all manner of unsafe jobs, such as cleaning asbestos, shoveling Coke ovens (for those not familiar with steelworker terminology, "Coke" is the substance that's left over after coal has been burned up), operating massive sheers designed to cut giant slabs of red-hot steel (sheers which can and have cut people entirely in half). At my mother's steel mill, people died from being crushed to death by falling Steel coils weighing tons, and there was not enough left of such people to scrape up with a spatula. She, too, worked there for 30 years.

And when she retired, instead of a pension, she got a lump sum of about 25,000 dollars. 25,000 for 30 years of a**-busting service. That's less than a 1000 dollars a YEAR.

Can you live on a grand a year? Do you know of anyone who can? I know I can't.

And I don't know anyone else who can. And why this madness? Because politicians sold those pensions down the river, in order to help out their corporate cronies.

Is THAT justice? I ask you, is that JUSTICE?! "In retrospect, the situation was laughable because here I was living on peanut butter and bread (or Ritz crackers when I could afford to splurge) for months at a time.

When I got to know this poor figure and heard her story I felt worse for her plight than for my own (I, after all, I thought I had everything to in front of me). I was genuinely appalled at one point, as we exchanged stories and commiserated with each other over our situations, when she in her grandmotherly fashion tried to convince me that I would be â€œhealthierâ€ eating cat food (like her) rather than trying to get all my substance from peanut butter and bread. I couldnâ€™t quite go there, but the impression was made.

I decided that I didnâ€™t trust big business to take care of me, and that I would take responsibility for my own future and myself." I too live on peanut butter and bread. Because I can afford little else.

I make 400 bucks a month.My rent and bills are more than that. Add on top of that thousands of dollars of college debt that I can't pay off, from several years of college that amounted to nothing because, as I was working 16 hour days AND going to school full time, I had to drop out after 3 years due to sheer exhaustion. I can forget about my dream of making a living as a novelist, because economics is a beast which devours all dreams, just like mine.

Like the tragic author of the above manifesto, I have learned better than to trust the business world to give a f*** about me. Because money truly does talk in our backwards society, and I cannot even hope to DREAM of ever having enough of it to matter to anyone who calls the shots. Am I the only one?

I doubt it. I'm willing to bet some of my Mahalo creds (because that's about the only currency I've got right now) that there are a huge number of you who are reading this who are exactly the same boat I am. Because that's how the system works.It's OUR guts, and THEIR gold.

OUR labor and THEIR Leer Jets. And all because the American electorate has been brainwashed to vote against their own interests. We are the proverbial crowd of peasants charging down the street screaming "MORE power to the rich!

MORE power to the Aristocracy! " How utterly stupid is that?"I remember reading about the stock market crash before the â€œgreatâ€ depression and how there were wealthy bankers and businessmen jumping out of windows when they realized they screwed up and lost everything. Isnâ€™t it ironic how far weâ€™ve come in 60 years in this country that they now know how to fix that little economic problem; they just steal from the middle class (who doesnâ€™t have any say in it, elections are a joke) to cover their asses and itâ€™s â€œbusiness-as-usualâ€.

Now when the wealthy f--k up, the poor get to die for the mistakesâ€¦ isnâ€™t that a clever, tidy solution." The preceding paragraph hit me hard. Do you want to know why?

I'll tell you why. Because I am the poor that get to die for the mistakes of the rich. My body is falling apart, piece by piece.

I walk with a permanent limp, I desperately need dentures, and my knees are already starting to give out. I'm pushing thirty, but years of hard labor have given me the body of a 60-year-old. Know what my healthcare plan is?

I'm on the "Advil and water" plan. Because that's the only healthcare that is available to me. I live in a "Right-to-Work" state, or as we call them, a "Right-to-Starve" state.

Employers are not required to provide s*** for us. And just when I thought maybe, just MAYBE I might finally be able to get some healthcare, our good friends the United States Senate decided that my life, and for that matter, your life, wasn't worth saving. And now, here is the reality.

I WILL die. Not from old age. But from lack of healthcare.

I WILL die. Thank you, United States Government and the Healthcare Industry! It's so touching that you have our best interests at heart, as always!

"I know Iâ€™m hardly the first one to decide I have had all I can stand.It has always been a myth that people have stopped dying for their freedom in this country, and it isnâ€™t limited to the blacks, and poor immigrants. I know there have been countless before me and there are sure to be as many after. But I also know that by not adding my body to the count, I insure nothing will change.

I choose to not keep looking over my shoulder at â€œbig brotherâ€ while he strips my carcass, I choose not to ignore what is going on all around me, I choose not to pretend that business as usual wonâ€™t continue; I have just had enough. " He's right about that. He was not the only one to have all he can stand.

And I cannot truly blame him for choosing to die rather than to let these wicked, EVIL people at the head of our Government continue to rape him. I do not in any way condone suicide, and certainly not homicide, but I understand fully what drove him to it. Because I'm ALSO at the "I've had enough" stage.

Only, I won't pick up a gun and kill myself and/or others. Nor will I fly a plane into a building. That's not my style.

Since it has been established that eventually, lack of healthcare, if not unsafe working conditions, will KILL ME, I've decided to fight back the only way I feel I can. I will continue to ROT this miserable, utterly broken system from the inside out until it falls apart at the seams and a new system is FORCED, or until I finally succumb and die. Whichever comes first.

That's how I fight a revolution, folks. "I can only hope that the numbers quickly get too big to be white washed and ignored that the American zombies wake up and revolt; it will take nothing less. I would only hope that by striking a nerve that stimulates the inevitable double standard, knee-jerk government reaction that results in more stupid draconian restrictions people wake up and begin to see the pompous political thugs and their mindless minions for what they are.

Sadly, though I spent my entire life trying to believe it wasnâ€™t so, but violence not only is the answer, it is the only answer. The cruel joke is that the really big chunks of s--t at the top have known this all along and have been laughing, at and using this awareness against, fools like me all along. I saw it written once that the definition of insanity is repeating the same process over and over and expecting the outcome to suddenly be different.

I am finally ready to stop this insanity. Well, Mr. Big Brother IRS man, letâ€™s try something different; take my pound of flesh and sleep well. The communist creed: From each according to his ability, to each according to his need.

The capitalist creed: From each according to his gullibility, to each according to his greed. " I sorrow at the death of Mr. Stack, and the circumstances which caused it. I also sorrow for everyone who was in any way hurt or grieved by his actions.

But I agree with his manifesto fully on every single point, and it does a good job of exposing the inherent, glaring flaws in our system. And Mr. Stack, though you're dead now, nonetheless I wish to say that you did not truly die in vain. Because even if I'm the only one in the world dedicated to the concept of drastic, irrevocable social/political/economic revolution, then at least the Revolution lives on in me.

And will do so until the moment I draw my very last breath. Despite the fact that you went out in a very sad way, driven to the point where all hope was lost, nonetheless, I pray that your words will convert a few sheep into human beings. The world needs less sheep, and more people in it.

Slowly, the business world is changing a little (thank you, @Jason and thank you, Wikipedia and Google for giving us at least that! ) but a little change is not even close to enough. I apologize for my overly lengthy answer to this question.

I didn't intend for it to be so long, but this is a subject that I've very passionate feelings about, and I've just literally released years of pent-up rage and frustration in the course of writing it. To end this answer, I'm going to put a bunch of pictures on the bottom of the answer. It's amazing how you can type one single word, "Despair", into Google Image search, and you come up with a bunch of pictures which describe this exact subject perfectly.

Viva la Revolucion. -Derek, "Baka13.

I have to be honest. I'm not normally given to displays of emotion. But I was weeping by the time I finished with this.

Because Joe Stack is me. Not just me. But people like me.

Because we DON'T live charmed lives. We're fed garbage that is designed to kill us. Everyone knows it.

But who has a will strong enough to resist? Often, we participate in this nightmare because we feel we have no choice. This is the only reality we know now.

Youâ€™ve got to be kidding! How can any rational individual explain that white elephant conundrum in the middle of our tax system and, indeed, our entire legal system? Here we have a system that is, by far, too complicated for the brightest of the master scholars to understand.

Yet, it mercilessly â€œholds accountableâ€ its victims, claiming that theyâ€™re responsible for fully complying with laws not even the experts understand. The law â€œrequiresâ€ a signature on the bottom of a tax filing; yet no one can say truthfully that they understand what they are signing; if thatâ€™s not â€œduressâ€ than what is. If this is not the measure of a totalitarian regime, nothing is."

Just in case anyone holds on to the delusion that this is a land of freedom and justice and conscience and liberty, just like the propaganda says, I ask where is paradise for people like "The West Memphis Three"? Where is justice for them? They're sitting on Death Row right now.

Because they were metal-heads. Where is paradise for them? Where is paradise for Leonard Peltier, who was illegally extradited from Canada, thrown into prison as a political prisoner, and denied the chance of ever again being a free man?

Where was paradise for Sacco and Vanzetti, who were executed just because they were Anarchists? Where is the justice for these people? Where is the justice for the people who spent years in the pen for selling drugs to feed their children, because our wonderful system couldn't provide them the basic necessities they needed to feed, shelter, clothe, educate, and nurture their families?

What answer can the powers-that-be give for this? Perhaps they've grown so arrogant, they feel they don't NEED to answer. Maybe they rest upon the law as if the law is its own justification.

WRONG! "My introduction to the real American nightmare starts back in the early â€˜80s. Unfortunately after more than 16 years of school, somewhere along the line I picked up the absurd, pompous notion that I could read and understand plain English.

Some friends introduced me to a group of people who were having â€˜tax codeâ€™ readings and discussions. In particular, zeroed in on a section relating to the wonderful â€œexemptionsâ€ that make institutions like the vulgar, corrupt Catholic Church so incredibly wealthy. We carefully studied the law (with the help of some of the â€œbestâ€, high-paid, experienced tax lawyers in the business), and then began to do exactly what the â€œbig boysâ€ were doing (except that we werenâ€™t steeling from our congregation or lying to the government about our massive profits in the name of God).

We took a great deal of care to make it all visible, following all of the rules, exactly the way the law said it was to be done. The intent of this exercise and our efforts was to bring about a much-needed re-evaluation of the laws that allow the monsters of organized religion to make such a mockery of people who earn an honest living. However, this is where I learned that there are two â€œinterpretationsâ€ for every law; one for the very rich, and one for the rest of usâ€¦ Oh, and the monsters are the very ones making and enforcing the laws; the inquisition is still alive and well today in this country."

And Churches do not have to contribute anything material to society. This is a rule which has endured for centuries. Why?

When the Roman Catholic Church alone has enough money to feed the entire world for months, why are they not following the freaking MESSAGE that Jesus Christ, the founder of their entire religion, put forth. Feeding the many? Yeah, that was a Jesus thing (whether or not one believes the stories is immaterial.

The whole point is in the message, a message which many if not all religions seems to have lost track of over the centuries). Funny how it was a Jesus thing. But not a Pope thing.

But I'm not singling out the Popes here. Because every single leader of every single religion in the world has failed in the same way, failed to see to the needs of their flocks. But people continue to flock to them.

Because, much like convicts, we're institutionalized to believe that this is the only way. And this double standard, these different sets of rules for the rich and the poor, to that I say, how dare they? But louder than that, I scream, "How dare WE?!

" For you see, we get exactly what we deserve. Because WE let this happen. I did.

You did. We all did. Our parents did.

Our grandparents did. Their parents did, and so on into the dim mists of antiquity. All because we didn't have the courage to stand up for ourselves.

There are 300 million Americans, give or take. How many of those Americans are there in all three branches of government? I'm willing to bet that the answer to that does not fall in the "millions" category.

How is it that thousands are able to control MILLIONS?! Because we let them. Every 4 years.

Now I know what you're saying."What do you want ME to do? I'm just one person. I can't make a difference.

Each and every one of us, as an individual, is powerless. But consider if only 10% of the total population of the U.S. Decided to take up arms and march on Washington? That's upwards of 30 million people.

What can 30 million people do? Well, they can do a lot more than 1 can. It has saddened me greatly throughout my life whenever I thought of examples like the Kent State incident, where 4 American citizens, college students, were gunned down by their own countrymen, National Guardsmen.

Where was the revolution then? There was none. Instead it was "Well, they killed four of us.

They're not playing around. I guess we'd better join the system and try to make as much money as we can. " Welcome to the '80's, the "Me" Decade.

And if you're looking for the genesis of all the woes you're suffering right now, the '80's is a good place to start looking. Rather than let the deaths of those four American citizens COUNT for something, rather than let that incident be the catalyst for a popular revolution to overthrow Capitalism and establish Direct Democracy, they just gave up. Just like we give up.

We sit there and watch Iraq and Afghanistan coverage on cable news, and we shake our heads, and say "That's a terrible shame. We shouldn't be over there. " But do we do anything to stop it?

Well, here's something I'm doing to stop it. It may not accomplish much, but at least I'm trying. To all citizens of the United States and to all servicemen and servicewomen serving here and abroad, I have this to say: IF YOU HAVE NOT JOINED THE ARMED FORCES, DON'T.

IF YOU HAVE JOINED THE ARMED FORCES, MUTINY. REFUSE TO FIGHT. I AM AWARE THIS STATEMENT WALKS THE LINE OF TREASON, AND I MAKE THIS STATEMENT ON MY OWN.

NEITHER MAHALO. COM NOR ANYONE ELSE ON THIS PLANET IS PARTY TO THIS STATEMENT. BUT YES, I ADVISE YOU TO MUTINY, BECAUSE YOUR LIVES ARE WORTH MORE TO ME THAN THEY ARE TO YOUR OWN GOVERNMENT!"The significance of independence, however, came much later during my early years of college; at the age of 18 or 19 when I was living on my own as student in an apartment in Harrisburg, Pennsylvania.

My neighbor was an elderly retired woman (80+ seemed ancient to me at that age) who was the widowed wife of a retired steel worker. Her husband had worked all his life in the steel mills of central Pennsylvania with promises from big business and the union that, for his 30 years of service, he would have a pension and medical care to look forward to in his retirement. Instead he was one of the thousands who got nothing because the incompetent mill management and corrupt union (not to mention the government) raided their pension funds and stole their retirement.

All she had was social security to live on. " The paragraph I just cited is exactly the point at which I started to cry. Because that old lady described in that paragraph might as well be my own Mother.

My Mother was a musical genius. She was composing music at age 3. She passed up a chance to go to Juliard so that she could raise a family.

Since she was a single mother with 3 kids, she went to work, naturally, at a place that seemed to pay a decent wage. Bethelhem Steel, Burns Harbor. She worked there for 30 years, performing all manner of unsafe jobs, such as cleaning asbestos, shoveling Coke ovens (for those not familiar with steelworker terminology, "Coke" is the substance that's left over after coal has been burned up), operating massive sheers designed to cut giant slabs of red-hot steel (sheers which can and have cut people entirely in half).

At my mother's steel mill, people died from being crushed to death by falling Steel coils weighing tons, and there was not enough left of such people to scrape up with a spatula. She, too, worked there for 30 years. And when she retired, instead of a pension, she got a lump sum of about 25,000 dollars.

25,000 for 30 years of a**-busting service. That's less than a 1000 dollars a YEAR. Can you live on a grand a year?

Do you know of anyone who can? I know I can't. And I don't know anyone else who can.

And why this madness? Because politicians sold those pensions down the river, in order to help out their corporate cronies.Is THAT justice? I ask you, is that JUSTICE?!"In retrospect, the situation was laughable because here I was living on peanut butter and bread (or Ritz crackers when I could afford to splurge) for months at a time.

I decided that I didnâ€™t trust big business to take care of me, and that I would take responsibility for my own future and myself. " I too live on peanut butter and bread. Because I can afford little else.

I make 400 bucks a month. My rent and bills are more than that. Add on top of that thousands of dollars of college debt that I can't pay off, from several years of college that amounted to nothing because, as I was working 16 hour days AND going to school full time, I had to drop out after 3 years due to sheer exhaustion.

I can forget about my dream of making a living as a novelist, because economics is a beast which devours all dreams, just like mine. Like the tragic author of the above manifesto, I have learned better than to trust the business world to give a f*** about me. Because money truly does talk in our backwards society, and I cannot even hope to DREAM of ever having enough of it to matter to anyone who calls the shots.

Am I the only one? I doubt it. I'm willing to bet some of my Mahalo creds (because that's about the only currency I've got right now) that there are a huge number of you who are reading this who are exactly the same boat I am.

Because that's how the system works. It's OUR guts, and THEIR gold. OUR labor and THEIR Leer Jets.

And all because the American electorate has been brainwashed to vote against their own interests. We are the proverbial crowd of peasants charging down the street screaming "MORE power to the rich! MORE power to the Aristocracy!

" How utterly stupid is that? "I remember reading about the stock market crash before the â€œgreatâ€ depression and how there were wealthy bankers and businessmen jumping out of windows when they realized they screwed up and lost everything. Isnâ€™t it ironic how far weâ€™ve come in 60 years in this country that they now know how to fix that little economic problem; they just steal from the middle class (who doesnâ€™t have any say in it, elections are a joke) to cover their asses and itâ€™s â€œbusiness-as-usualâ€.

Now when the wealthy f--k up, the poor get to die for the mistakesâ€¦ isnâ€™t that a clever, tidy solution. " The preceding paragraph hit me hard.Do you want to know why? I'll tell you why.

Because I am the poor that get to die for the mistakes of the rich.My body is falling apart, piece by piece. I walk with a permanent limp, I desperately need dentures, and my knees are already starting to give out. I'm pushing thirty, but years of hard labor have given me the body of a 60-year-old.

Know what my healthcare plan is? I'm on the "Advil and water" plan. Because that's the only healthcare that is available to me.

I live in a "Right-to-Work" state, or as we call them, a "Right-to-Starve" state. Employers are not required to provide s*** for us. And just when I thought maybe, just MAYBE I might finally be able to get some healthcare, our good friends the United States Senate decided that my life, and for that matter, your life, wasn't worth saving.

And now, here is the reality. I WILL die. Not from old age.

But from lack of healthcare. I WILL die. Thank you, United States Government and the Healthcare Industry!

It's so touching that you have our best interests at heart, as always! "I know Iâ€™m hardly the first one to decide I have had all I can stand. It has always been a myth that people have stopped dying for their freedom in this country, and it isnâ€™t limited to the blacks, and poor immigrants.

I know there have been countless before me and there are sure to be as many after. But I also know that by not adding my body to the count, I insure nothing will change. I choose to not keep looking over my shoulder at â€œbig brotherâ€ while he strips my carcass, I choose not to ignore what is going on all around me, I choose not to pretend that business as usual wonâ€™t continue; I have just had enough."

He's right about that. He was not the only one to have all he can stand. And I cannot truly blame him for choosing to die rather than to let these wicked, EVIL people at the head of our Government continue to rape him.

I do not in any way condone suicide, and certainly not homicide, but I understand fully what drove him to it. Because I'm ALSO at the "I've had enough" stage. Only, I won't pick up a gun and kill myself and/or others.

Nor will I fly a plane into a building. That's not my style. Since it has been established that eventually, lack of healthcare, if not unsafe working conditions, will KILL ME, I've decided to fight back the only way I feel I can.

I will continue to ROT this miserable, utterly broken system from the inside out until it falls apart at the seams and a new system is FORCED, or until I finally succumb and die. Whichever comes first. That's how I fight a revolution, folks."I can only hope that the numbers quickly get too big to be white washed and ignored that the American zombies wake up and revolt; it will take nothing less.

I would only hope that by striking a nerve that stimulates the inevitable double standard, knee-jerk government reaction that results in more stupid draconian restrictions people wake up and begin to see the pompous political thugs and their mindless minions for what they are. Sadly, though I spent my entire life trying to believe it wasnâ€™t so, but violence not only is the answer, it is the only answer. The cruel joke is that the really big chunks of s--t at the top have known this all along and have been laughing, at and using this awareness against, fools like me all along.

I saw it written once that the definition of insanity is repeating the same process over and over and expecting the outcome to suddenly be different. I am finally ready to stop this insanity. Well, Mr. Big Brother IRS man, letâ€™s try something different; take my pound of flesh and sleep well.

The communist creed: From each according to his ability, to each according to his need. The capitalist creed: From each according to his gullibility, to each according to his greed." I sorrow at the death of Mr. Stack, and the circumstances which caused it.

I also sorrow for everyone who was in any way hurt or grieved by his actions. But I agree with his manifesto fully on every single point, and it does a good job of exposing the inherent, glaring flaws in our system. And Mr. Stack, though you're dead now, nonetheless I wish to say that you did not truly die in vain.

Because even if I'm the only one in the world dedicated to the concept of drastic, irrevocable social/political/economic revolution, then at least the Revolution lives on in me. And will do so until the moment I draw my very last breath. Despite the fact that you went out in a very sad way, driven to the point where all hope was lost, nonetheless, I pray that your words will convert a few sheep into human beings.

The world needs less sheep, and more people in it. Slowly, the business world is changing a little (thank you, @Jason and thank you, Wikipedia and Google for giving us at least that!) but a little change is not even close to enough. I apologize for my overly lengthy answer to this question.

I didn't intend for it to be so long, but this is a subject that I've very passionate feelings about, and I've just literally released years of pent-up rage and frustration in the course of writing it.To end this answer, I'm going to put a bunch of pictures on the bottom of the answer. It's amazing how you can type one single word, "Despair", into Google Image search, and you come up with a bunch of pictures which describe this exact subject perfectly. Viva la Revolucion.

-Derek, "Baka13.

I really feel his pain. At one point, I was hiring contract engineers. I was a recruiter.

I had to fire one guy once, on my manager's orders, and I felt awful about it. This was several years after that law was passed. The guy was walking 2 hours to work because he had 4 kids, was building his own home, and had sunk everything he had into it.As a result he had BO, even though he showered once at work.

My company had two complaints about him--just two--and then I was told to fire the guy. If you'd ever told me I could make a guy cry that was twice my age, I wouldn't have believed you. I then went to the restroom and tossed my lunch.

I felt truly evil that day. I know for a fact the middle class is being squeezed out of existence. I've heard this several times in statistics over the years; I've felt it myself.

It's really not a good world where you're either worrying constantly about the next meal, or you're worrying constantly about all your investments. There has been a "middle class" for hundreds of years, since the rise of the merchants in the Middle Ages. Or even earlier, with the similar class in ancient Rome.

Now it seems to be sink or swim in the Olympics. Stack wanted to make a splash. He did it.

He compares it to sacrificing his life for many. Unfortunately he took other lives in the process.

Then I am told after I get the cards that I have to use them or it doesn't help my credit. So I use them and then they keep my score low so they can charge my higher interest rates by floating due dates or slowly processing payments. I understand his issue with the IRS and the royal screw job that the middle class is getting and has been getting for awhile.

I don't agree at with how he handled it. It doesn't help his case being branded as a terrorist. I don't know what the answer is to the problem.

I do understand his frustration suffering at the hands of the IRS and having what you worked so hard for taken away from you with no recourse. He should have put his software engineering skills to work and put up a website to advocate for those that have been harmed by the IRS and big government. Started a Not For Profit Organization and found allies in the media and on the Internet to help him and build a coalition to petition the government to fix the problems I have heard from CPA's the tax situation is a mess this year and they even admit no one really understands it anymore.

I have seen Not For Profits have money pulled from their checking or savings accounts because a form was filed late. An organization that serves a community could have been pushed out of existence because someone made a mistake. People who worked for that organization could have not gotten paid if there wasn't enough money and that was just their problem.

Jason, maybe it is time to put up a single site that people can report these issues and maybe get government to take notice of the majority of the middle class who are just being squeezed to death. Flying a plane into a building solves nothing. But getting people together to stand with one voice and say it is time we have fairness and equity for all.

I will start by pointing out that this man was a worthless piece of human garbage, whose actions do nothing but undermine any point he was trying to make. This is unfortunate, because a lot of the points he is hovering around (usually without really making) are things the country could stand to discuss. Frankly, instead of inspiring people who might actually have been persuaded to agree with his positions to revolt, he has only made himself revolting.

S manifesto is one long screed about how all his financial problems come from pretty much anybody but himself, and without government/corporate/religious meddling his life would have been swell. Somehow this seems to be justification in his mind for trying to murder potentially 200 strangers, as well as burning down his family's house and putting his own wife's life in danger.(1) Talk about your epic temper-tantrums... Moving on, I'll say he suffers from the same problem as most tax-protesters--he's preaching to the choir, and not making much effort to explain to non-tax-protesters exactly how the government's tax laws ruined his life, beyond saying "I tried to avoid paying as much of my taxes as possible, and the IRS caught me breaking their rules. Then they hit me with the fines and back-pay theyâ€™ve always said they would.It's not fair!

*SOB*â€? , followed by claims that taxes are too complicated for anyone to manage. This would be more effective if a cursory examination of his history with the IRS didnâ€™t paint a pretty clear picture of a man who didnâ€™t give a hoot about following tax law in the first place.(2) Including a link to the discussion of the 1986 tax changes was helpful in showing an actual example of what he thought was wrong with the law.

That bit of legislation is bad, but really, none of the things he brings up have me convinced government meddling has destroyed his life to the extent he's trying to claim. Theyâ€™re certainly not worth killing over. S links aren't the best for explaining what exactly that law did (my sources explain the problem a little better, I think).(4a-c) It's unclear to me why so many people discuss this as if it makes it impossible for a independent contractor to work directly for a customer as an IC--that law shouldn't affect them unless they're working as part of a 3-party arrangement (customer, contractor, and something like a temp agency).

Companies that didn't understand this may have been skittish about hiring independent contractors, but that seems like something a bit of judicious advertising about the state of the law could have prevented, not an insurmountable barrier to working as an IC. I like how he closes with "the capitalist creed: from each according to his gullibility, to each according to his greed". I'm sure this is meant to be commentary on the (admittedly) unfair plutocratic system this country seems to have developed.It's pretty ironic hearing it come from this guy, though.

He seems to feel entitled to higher wages than the people he's working for are paying, and thinks the government should regulate them more to ensure that he gets that extra money (naturally he has no justification for why he's earned it, he just gives a bare assertion that he should be making more than he is). He acts like nothing he could have done would have made him successful in his career, when plenty of other computer techs adapted to the new legislation and market slumps just fine. Apparently he thinks the US government should keep military bases open for no real reason other than shoring up the economy in his neighborhood.

I say this as a military brat, with friends and family in the military, who has lived in multiple towns that would be devastated if their bases ever closed: it is unfair to expect the whole country to dump money into your town every year for an unnecessary base. It's hypocritical to expect that while youâ€™re railing against the government investing a fixed amount of money to keep companies that are the keystone of numerous local economies across the country from collapsing. This guy seems to have been fine with government intervention and using scads of taxpayer money as long as it ended up benefiting him personally.

Somehow that isn't greed in his mind--greed is only for corporations, politicians, and the Catholic Church (?! ). He seems to be rather myopic about the possible effects of not bailing out some of these companies, both on the nation and on his own bottom line.

For example, I'm sure his efforts at finding work in airplane-related fields would have been much better had the airlines not been bailed out post 9-11. Also, clearly promoting easy access to his clients was more important than security at that time (*end sarcasm*). He seems to have been far more interested in sticking it to the man than doing whatâ€™s best for the country, or even what was best for himself and his family.

He complains that it's the government's fault he couldn't command the pay he thought he should be getting, due to them meddling in his financial affairs (through taxes), not meddling in them (by not forcing companies to pay him more), and through the government not being able to stop market crashes (though he appears to hate pretty much everything the government has tried to do to prevent their complete collapse). Itâ€™s unclear what role he thinks the government is supposed to play beyond putting Joe Stackâ€™s interests before all others, and asking for as little as possible in return. With the exception of citing his time eating cheap garbage in college (like pretty much everybody else I've ever known), and his alleged no-income period, he doesn't really sound like a poor person.

He apparently managed to earn enough money to buy (and keep) a plane, and to get (and keep) a pilot's license. While I've known people who weren't rich and flew their own planes, it isn't exactly a common pastime for people with no money. He somehow lost track of $12,700 of income on his family's taxes, which seems strange for someone making anything close to the median family income in this country (around $73,000 for married couples), let alone for a poor family.(3) How could you not notice that large of a percentage of your household income missing on your documentation?

Of course, that's assuming he actually made a good faith effort to check his taxes (as he claims he did). In more recent articles, his accountant claims Stack didnâ€™t tell him about all of his family income, and when he finally found out and the IRS was auditing him, Stack ignored the audit until it was too late to do anything.(5) Now, he could be lying, but so far I find him more credible than Stack. I don't have a problem with people taking the deductions and credits that are legally available to them.

However, rather than actually making an honest assessment of his tax situation, Stack joined a group with exactly the same beliefs he had, and took advice solely from people who would tell him what he wanted to hear--that is, that he didn't have to pay taxes. Then he acted surprised when taking these alleged "loopholes" that only the "brilliant minds" in his group claimed were legal turned out to be illegal. Gee, what a shock!

Speaking to anybody (and I mean ANYBODY) outside of his little group would have made it clear that these â€œloopholesâ€? Were ridiculous and illegal.(2) He attempted to say that his house was a church, because he felt it was unfair for churches to get tax breaks that he couldnâ€™t take advantage of. It would be absurd to tax a non-profit religious institution in the same way we tax a solitary, for-profit worker.

Their situations are nothing alike. The IRS has been clear about this.(6) But that didnâ€™t matter to Stackâ€”somebody was getting a break, and that person wasnâ€™t him. He claims he was gullible to try to follow the laws of our nation, but doesn't seem to understand that he was gullible to think these tax-dodgers actually knew what they were talking about.

Or, that he must really think weâ€™re gullible to assume weâ€™ll believe he actually thought posing as a church was a legal way for a computer tech to not pay taxes. Not to mention that weâ€™d need to be really gullible to think this was something done out of patriotism rather than greed. He positions himself as someone who made a reasonable effort to understand his tax obligations, but his history says otherwise.(2) He seems to believe that because he wrote letters to his congresspeople (and apparently everyone else's), and they didn't do what he wanted them to, that means he didn't have representation.

He ignores the fact that there are a lot of other people in the country who don't necessarily agree with his positions who deserve representation too. He has the assumption that all the middle-class and poor citizens of the country would agree with all of his positions, but doesn't support it with evidence. Clearly he thinks that the government's disinclination to have Joe-Stack-friendly positions is evidence of the insidious influence of corporations, but he doesn't actually say anything to prove that.

He claims the movement against the 1986 legislation was destroyed by corporate agents working inside the movement, and doesn't support that with any evidence. Nor does he give any indication that he has considered any other possible explanation for why this legislation may have passed that doesn't fit his conspiracy theory. Regardless of the truth of his assertions, he is arguing from his gut rather than reality.

This isn't to say his positions are all wrong, just that a person shouldn't claim their arguments are being ignored if they aren't actually making their arguments in the first place. While I encourage people to write to their congresspeople (every little bit helps), and meeting with people who agree with your political positions can be a positive step toward getting desired changes enacted, there are a lot of other ways this man could have gotten his message out without murder and suicide. Most of the big ones are outlined here: http://www.factnet.org/A_Summary_of_Social_Activism_Techniques.htm (As an aside, I donâ€™t know much about factnet.Org, so this isnâ€™t meant to promote themâ€”I just liked their summary) Just whining about the unfairness of life to your friends and politicians isn't going to make change happen.

Come to think of it, from reading the news articles about this tragedy, Stack didn't even get as far as whining to his friends. Most of them had no idea he felt this way about taxes, so this guy was even more ineffectual than most protesters.(1)(7) Perhaps he didn't want to risk hearing people he cared about disagree with him. People trying to affect change in the country should avoid letting kooks like this become the face of their movement.

Stack has probably seriously set back his cause, and the people who are celebrating his actions are making things even worse. Nobody wants to support a cause championed by murderers and the people who love them. Stack thought he was rallying "patriots" to water the tree of liberty with blood, or something equally delusional.

What he's really done is terrorism, trying to sway the country to his will by forcing government action and encouraging violence against innocent people. It isn't like all those office drones at the IRS building are responsible for this guy's problems, or our shoddy tax laws. They didn't write them.

Resorting to violence just shows that his argument isn't compelling on its own. What he has done just shows that he was monstrously selfish.In addition to believing he had a right to stay here, using all the services the government provides, without paying the tab our laws make it clear he owes for the privilege, this guy thought he had a right to destroy a building (two, if he did indeed burn down his family's house), and kill a bunch of people just to make his point. Then, he left a manifesto that he obviously knew wasnâ€™t going to be very effective in changing anybodyâ€™s mind (but would let him vent without hearing any rebuttals) and left his wife and children to deal with the aftermath of his actions.(7) The man was an irresponsible coward, and it will be a shame if his actions are what leads this country to reexamine its tax laws.

Apologies to anyone looking for an impartial, objective analysis of his manifesto--his actions were just beyond the pale for me.

S "terroristic act" served three purposes: (1) It will result in ridiculous Homeland Security laws against every US Citizen (aka domestic terrorists). He foreshadows this in his note, if you read closely. He foreshadows that a revolution is imminent and necessary.

He felt that he was starting it by prompting the "kneejerk reaction" of Big Brother. He hoped that this reaction would prompt a violent revolution, which he felt was the only way to change things. (2) It was a final vent for his anger against the IRS, as he attacked a local IRS office.It was a futile gesture, but was more for a symbol of his anger.

(3) It ended his life. He was tired and didn't want to be here anymore. I sympathize with this man.

It is very hard to get ahead in this country financially, as you're constantly pushed around by the mega rich or the government. Look at what happened to the retired steelworker's wife. The IRS Tax Code wasn't even properly set up, and it's not enforced objectively (how can it be, when no one understands everything in it).

Many people want a revolution in this country but are unwilling to participate in any violence to obtain one. They are unwilling because they feel they can have a revolution without violence. Joe Stack was beyond thinking about any nonviolent revolution.

He thought everyone was too comfortable to care about starting one. S act will likely result in acts against normal, innocent people via restrictive DHS legislation for domestic terrorists. Joe Stack thinks this is the only way to "wake them up.

" I still think there could have been other paths to change that didn't involve the loss of life. He could have ranted about his findings and become a conspiracy theorist millionaire, like Jeff Rense.

Whether you agree with me or not, suicide in any form is an act of a coward. Strength is in fighting, losing, getting back up, and fighting again. For those that are claiming this man to be a hero, have you thought of the message that you're sending to the rest of the country, and the world for that matter?

Want to be a hero? Didn't get the grade you thought your deserved? Just drive your car into the front entrance of your school!

That will get their attention! Silly isn't it? So is the idea of crashing a plane into a federal building because life didn't go your way.

I can completely agree that our government is failing us, horribly. But I certainly don't think that those injustices warrant this type violent behavior. Columbine?

The Oklahoma City Bombings? Virginia Tech? These were all acts of violence, because someone felt injustice.

Regardless of the reason, these people intentionally placed themselves and others in harms way....and for what? The credibility of their belief. Stupid.

I am the product of a horrific childhood, dealt the short end of the stick for years. Beaten and abused, poor and unworthy.....does this entitle me to drive a semi truck into a preschool, just to prove a point? No it does not!

I think we need to examine how we are reacting to this. He is not a hero. Heroes save lives, struggle to go on in the face of adversity, and show strength when others can not.

This man was a coward. S death will not change anything. What he failed to realize, is hundreds of thousands of Americans have died throughout the years, struggling for a change.

Civil rights and even present today as we continue to lose lives overseas....for a war most of us do not believe is necessary. He died in vain. That is the saddest part.

I don't believe it's right to cause physical harm to someone who is not personally physically endangering you or your family or someone you consider you should protect from harm, etc. If that makes sense. But I respect the freedom that people have to make a choice about what they are going to do with their life, and I don't feel it's in my best interests to personally judge or condemn those who, for example, join an army believing that they are doing a good, important, or "necessary evil" thing, or feeling that it is the only option available to provide for their needs and that they "probably won't end up killing anyone who is innocent". What I've just said seems to me to be completely riddled with contradictions and oxymorons, but I don't want to continue on that here, I just want to express a few other thoughts on the question without ending up in a political debate or offending anyone.

I must admit, very often I find myself wondering, "Do any Americans still believe in the idea that the "system" by which their lives are run, organised, looked after, whatever you want to call it, really works and has much justice or fairness? " As a non-American, I find America incredibly intriguing, confusing, mindboggling, unbelievable.... I don't know how to even explain it. After growing up with Disney movies and American TV etc, I remember becoming a teenager and learning about some things, and just feeling like scales were falling from my eyes.

I have never lived in the USA and have met very few Americans in person. So I can't exactly stand by this vision of America that I have, 100%. I don't live there.

So what I say or think comes only from the information sources I have access to that I have a reasonable amount of faith in. (There's another thing that is it's own thousand-strong set of discussion threads.) I still remember the first few times that I saw examples, through the media, of the worldview of many Americans. It just gobsmacked me.

I don't want to inflame people's sensitivities, but... I have to be honest, there seem to be quite a few Americans who, to me, seem far crazier and more disconnected from reality than any terrorist, dangerous religious fanatic, cult member, etc.What I find heartening is the fact that the "world-view" I have seen in certain Americans seems to definitely be on the decline. The worldview (or maybe "America-View") I'm talking about was, as far as I understood, pretty common until maybe just the last decade or so. It still seems to be very strong in some places, but... I've been absolutely fascinated by the changes that appear, to me, to be happening in American culture.

I feel glad to know that this world-view that at times I've thought pervaded the majority of Americans is very much an individual thing, and there must be plenty of people who have never subscribed to it nor subscribe now. I'm not nationalistic at all, and there are huge numbers of things in my country that make me want to put my head in my hands and weep at the hopelessness/unfairness/futility at times. But I've got to say that we do seem to have some sort of system where what people want and need has some level of influence in what happens and what gets done.

I don't understand nearly enough about the political system of my country or any other to authoritatively make the following statement. But my understanding is that over here, and in many other democratic countries, there are extremely strict rules that anyone who is in government or making decisions on behalf of people can pretty much NEVER, EVER, have anything to do with any money from any source other than prescribed, extremely scritinized, transparent income from the government itself for their job?..... And the government itself, and its bodies and departments, cannot have any real connections or overlap of any kind with any corporation or anything except for itself?.... From what I understand, this seems to just not be the case in the USA and I just can't understand how or why? I can't understand why this has not been changed or how this came about in the first place?

I just don't understand the things I read or hear about how the system works over there! I am just gobsmacked about the idea of senators or anybody in the government, or any party or group of that kind, having any ties or contributions or anything whatsoever to do with any corporations, business, anything! I just don't understand the idea that this is allowed in any way!

When I first tried to find out a bit about this stuff, and a few other things about the way the USA works, I just went, "OH. So THAT'S whats wrong with everything over there. " What seems to be normal over there would be the most incredible scandal over here!

We just don't get it! I can't understand why there has not been some kind of revolution or coup or something, except for the fact that.... I don't know... can you really ever overthrow your government or your system with that amount of military might behind it?.... And with the military and everything related to it being such an important source of income for so many people?... I'm not sure, does the USA also have a completely independent, accountable, taxpayer-funded media with no business or financial links to anything else and no censorship being done in the wrong way...? That doesn't hurt either if you have one of those and it's working well....? Maybe it's just a cultural thing too, I've seen American comedians etc. Come on Australian variety comedy/talk shows and just scream with amazement and delight at the things that they can't believe we would joke about or talk about on TV here.... Of course I don't fully understand the problem or solution. But what can I say is.... while I don't condone the actions of some people and the ways they go about making their point, I quite often sympathise more with the overall ideology and "complaints" of certain kinds of people who are doing crazy things to try to change something or get people to wake up.

I will always find the USA extremely fascinating, unbelievable, and intriguing for so many reasons. What really interests me is where it is heading and what's going to happen next. A 1999 Rage Against The Machine lyric, referring to America's place in the world and its influence on the world around it, says "We've reached the end of history.

It's caged and frozen still. There is no other pill to take, So swallow the one that makes you ill." Which makes you think... Yeah!

In the past the biggest empires and world powers have pretty much always had a use-by date - in time, change occurred. So what will happen in America's case and when? Throughout the lives of many generations of people, the USA has been the dominant world power, the head of the world.

We all thought Americans must be happy with what is happening in their country and living the best lives. Now that we know it isn't true, we wonder... can they actually do anything about it, from the inside? When change occurs, what will be the catalysts and the methods?

Actually, I just posted a question related to this the other day. I had just watched Weird Al Yankovich's "Canadian Idiot" clip and had realised how weird the idea of being in a "commonwealth" and having something to do with the Queen must be to Americans... How strange it must be to have these sort of almost-American neighbours, whose lives are so vastly different.My question was about what you think American life would be like now if the independence had never occurred. I do regularly wonder, are the citizens of the USA in any position to change something they don't like, don't agree with, or don't feel is fair or just?

And how many of them believe that change needs to occur?

This act will be to all the discontented wingnuts what 9-11 was to the Jihadists...

I believe that he speaks for so many of us hard working Americans who are at the mercy of Big Brother. I do not agree with what he did (crashed a plane) but I do very well understand his thought process. There are countless people all around the US who go to teas parties who openly vent and tell others how they feel.

Perhaps those tea parties will be heard some day. Perhaps not, but one can hope. I had come in here to post a link for the buzz page I created.. I did not realized before I wrote the page that this manifesto existed.

Here is a lengthy thought process that I have been putting on many other forums since Joseph A. Stack gave his life. I modify it as necessary to fit the attitude of the forum in question, and to enlighten the ones who may read it.

Admittedly it is a long post, but I feel that it adequately describes the thoughts in the minds of many Americans. Feel free to borrow from my post because this idea isn't just mine alone this is an idea that many people share and no one single person can own it. Personally, I think Joseph A.

Stack is a hero. He did something that has been in the minds of many outraged Americans for years, and I agree that things have gotten to the point that violence will be the only voice heard. Joseph A.

Stack wasn't some moron that didn't know what he was talking about, he was an engineer and a well informed citizen capable of expressing his thoughts clearly and accurately. I'm not saying that people without formal educations should be overlooked, I am merely pointing out that he was intelligent enough to realize the sorry state our nation is in and take the only course of action left for many of us. Some would say "Joseph was a wealthy engineer that could afford an airplane, so he couldnâ€™t have been too bad off".

The truth is, despite the assets he had, he was backed into a corner by the same institutions that propose to govern us. These same institutions have backed many of us into similar corners by controlled manipulative consumerism or strong-arm robbery on their part. If you don't believe me then consider the home foreclosures and outrageous credit card debts a majority of Americans have been plagued with.

If you don't believe me then consider the outrageous gas prices and tax hikes we have seen lately. Sure, they would appear to be unrelated...but aren't they all governed by the same greedy corporations that work in tandem to rob us of our value as human beings? The bottom line is, it is time for our government and the corporations that run it to begin fearing and respecting us as American citizens.

I would prefer that they listen to us under peaceful circumstances, but they have shown that they are unwilling to do that. All of the voting, demonstration rallies, and letters of complaints written to congressmen that have been ignored for so long have proven this. So, logically speaking what is the next step for us as a nation and as a people?

I think Joseph A. Stack had the correct answer. In reference to "Fight Club"... s name wasn't Robert Paulson it was Joseph A.

Stack To further modify this, I would like to point out that his wife and daughter weren't even home when he set his house on fire. I urge every red blooded American to consider what Joseph Stack did and consider taking similar steps. I know it's a sickening thought I really do and I can't believe it has come to this, but letâ€™s face it we were blatantly shown that our votes don't mean anything to the powers that be.

We have been shown that nothing we do will change their mind except for violence. Please don't get caught up in racism or political finger-pointing. Many have said things to the effect of "If he were Muslim or an Arab there would have been more concern about this and the government would take a more drastic approach".

It has also been said that he was a member of the Tea Party, which makes some believe that he was a right winged extremist nut job. The fact of the matter is, Joseph A. Stack was a decent hardworking American citizen by all counts.

He tried numerous times throughout his life to simply live the American dream, and was denied on every attempt so he decided that it was time to take a more proactive approach. The point I am making here is that this is something that every American citizen can get behind regardless of race or political preference because we all pay taxes in the end don't we? Here are some other things to consider, the following are comparisons to our modern day America that we live in and two other points in history.

One of them being the time slightly before and during the French Revolution, the other one being right before and during the Nazi takeover of Germany before and during World War 2. In France before and during the French Revolution: There were political and social inequalities. The French elite enjoyed privileges that simply were not available to the common person.It even got to the point that the common person had virtually no voice in politics.

They did however get to work and pay unfair taxes. The King of France Louis XIV had spent so much that France had become bankrupt. S ministers and noble clergy did nothing to cut their spending to alleviate the financial problem.

S successor Louis XVI even dismissed those in power who tried to balance the financial situation. Once 1789 had rolled around France was bankrupt. The people were even afraid that the king would suppress what little voice the lower class had, known as the National Assembly.

Finally the infamous "Storming of the Bastille" took place and the French Revolution was finally underway. In America Now: There are political and social inequalities.Name your case; I am sure any one of you can name a few. Our elite few enjoy wealth and privileges not available to us such as the big corporate bailouts that only seem to line the pockets of the greedy CEOs and their immediate underlings.

Many of our political leaders are renowned for enjoying privileges we can scarcely imagine; once again take your pick. Our voices in politics have been and possibly always have been removed from being able to make any real impact. The fact that Bush was allowed to serve two terms when he faced high opposition proved this, and the Electoral College further proved this point.

Our ministers have spent so much that we are now almost bankrupt; people are losing their homes and drowning in debt every single day. We have gotten to a point that we are honestly convinced that anything we try to do as a people will meet such high opposition that it will meet a brick wall. In Germany before and during the Nazi Occupation: There was the Enabling Act that reads a lot like a certain act we are familiar with in America today.

There were prison camps set up that very few German citizens were fully aware of, they simply knew they existed and learned to fear them. The German people were given the Jew; a nameless, faceless enemy that was responsible for the many crimes Germany had suffered for, the threat of being a Jew would serve to sew discord and distrust among everyone to the point that anyone speaking out against tler would be called a conspirator and promptly dealt with. Control of the media and mass propaganda were in place to ensure that the German people would only know what tler and his goons wanted them to know.

In America Now: We enjoy all of the security provided for us by The Patriot Act, which reads a lot like The Enabling Act. We have been made vaguely aware of a concentration camp in Guantanamo Bay and there are allegations of several others in the middle east that are still in operation. We are given the Terrorist, a nameless faceless enemy that is somehow responsible for all of the troubles we endure as American citizens.

The Terrorist has been used to sew distrust and discord among us, any thought of speaking out against the policies currently in place may cause the government to deal with us with such techniques as blacklisting etc.Our media has been under the control of the government and other large corporations for years, there is even an act circulating right now known as The Cyber Security Act of 2009. Once again I hate the idea of violence, I truly do...but let's face it these similarities can no longer be ignored. What does it take for us to look at history and realize what is happening?

In Germany it literally took Nazi Soldiers coming into towns and taking people from their homes in the middle of the day, and even then people in the next town were hard pressed to believe that people were being hauled off by the truckload to be placed in large ovens so that they could be burned alive. Is that what it's going to take for us to wake up? This isn't some conspiracy theory cooked up by some nerds in a basement that can't get a date on a Saturday night...these are actual facts.

Thank you for taking the time to read what I have posted, I truly appreciate your patience and I sincerely hope that at least one person has walked away from what I have written here with a higher purpose and awareness.

One, it strikes me strange that Joe Stack blamed everyone but himself. Two, if he wanted communism so bad, why didn't he hop a boat to China? There ARE options, after all.

Sounds to me like he wanted to be a victim until the end. A very well informed and educated victim, but a victim nevertheless.

He contradicts himself. On one hand he complains about the Detroit bailout (which saved over 100k jobs), but then he asks why there wasn't a bailout in california when the military bases were closed.

Since 9/11/01, our Government has insisted on knee jerk reactions that have been uneducated at best. One only has to look at U.S. And you will find a direct tie to our economic situation. Each action our national leaders take costs money.

Though we know these actions are taken based on what is thought to be best at the time, decisions have backfired in the sense of homeland and international relations. As a result of the public tendency to not think before acting, people in corporate positions that have direct influence on society as a whole as well as each and every community the local level leaders serve see some sort of impact. Remember th eold adage that every action causes an equal and opposite reaction.

This is not only a scientific fact, but a fact of a large society such as we live in here in the U.S.A. Employers become questioning about the expenditures they make, which also has an economic angle. As we know, political and economic issues go hand in hand. Jobs are lost, people fall behind on their bills, their mortgages, rents, car payments, taxes, etc.This creates a crisis which can undo even the most stable person.

The actions of this pilot who crashed his plane were aimed at the wrong people, but they were also meant to send a message to our nation's leaders. Like Amy, I am appalled that lives were taken and people injured.It was reported that only one person died, but it was one person too many. The investigation into this man is still on-going and it will not surprise anyone to find that he had issues in his life as a result of the same issues impacting him that impact all of us.

He targeted the IRS because he felt as if they were being overbearing on his tax situation. He felt targeted by unfair actions taken, and likely could not afford to obtain legal counsel to help him out. Let's examine what type of person does this, and the concerns that are now raised.

It is likely that he was paying the IRS back for having fallen behind on his taxes or even accidentally reporting his taxes improperly. Taxes and tax forms are complicated things. People get audited all the time for mistakes which are most times not any sort of crime, but the audit takes place to make sure of this.

He likely did not know that he could work something out with the IRS, he had other factors that played out in his unraveling. He became distraught, paranoid, angry, felt like a victim. He was likely in a state where he suffered from what professionals call "Persecution Disorder".

Maybe this man even suffered from some other emotional or behavioral problem.In the end, he had a psychotic break. He was going to pay back all the wrongs against him whether real or perceived. The pilot of this plane saw no way out of his problem, saw himself as a loser, a burden on his family, his self-esteem dropped with the other emotions overriding his sense of ability to compose himself.

S reasoning skills diminished. In all of the turmoil, he became suicidal and homocidal at the same time. Why did he target the Texas office?

There may be some possibility that the pilot knew he stood very little chance of a successful attack on D.C.Given all the flight restrictions in place. He also knew that to do the most damage, he would need as much fuel in his plane as possible. The pilot of the plane knew that compared to a large airliner, his plane was not going to pack much of a punch.

Premeditation was likely a factor here. He knew he would not need a flight plan, knew his intentions would not be questioned. He could just take-off, carry out his plan, and it would all be over.In the end, this pilot took more than just one life...he irreparibly harmed the lives of everyone involved to include his own family.

In that manner, he took their lives from them. He killed their spirits, and caused a lifetime of trauma.

For people's convenience, here are news details: myfoxillinois.com/dpps/news/dpgo-who-is-... businessinsider.com/fears-raised-that-au... No word yet on injuries, fatalities.

This was not an instance of domestic terrorism, or terrorism at all. 1. Stack didn't make any demands of the civilian population of the government before the attack.2.It wasn't religiously or seemingly politically motivated (it was *legally* motivated, if you read it well enough).

3. It wasn't an attack against civilians, it was an attack against the government. And it's really that last point that's the deal breaker.

Terrorists don't really attack governments, they attack civilians. He didn't do that. A horrible crime certainly, but still just a crime.

Mass murder with a plane because you're nuts and unhappy is still just mass murder, no different than when done with a knife or a rifle.

Here is the way I see it. If a man flies a plane into a building, or shoots random people, or blows himself up in a crowded market, I don't want to read his manifesto, or hear his reasoning or have anything to do with him. I would also prefer his name be stricken from public record instead of becoming a martyr or hero of some sort.

Yes, there are great problems with the American system of government. Does that mean we should resort to anarchy or terrorism (and then have our media exploit it to no end)? I did not read this manifesto, and I do not intend to.It's too disgusting.

I sorrow at the death of Mr. Stack, and the circumstances which caused it. I also sorrow for everyone who was in any way hurt or grieved by his actions. But I agree with his manifesto fully on every single point, and it does a good job of exposing the inherent, glaring flaws in our system.

And Mr. Stack, though you're dead now, nonetheless I wish to say that you did not truly die in vain. Because even if I'm the only one in the world dedicated to the concept of drastic, irrevocable social/political/economic revolution, then at least the Revolution lives on in me. And will do so until the moment I draw my very last breath.

I cant really gove you an answer,but what I can give you is a way to a solution, that is you have to find the anglde that you relate to or peaks your interest. A good paper is one that people get drawn into because it reaches them ln some way.As for me WW11 to me, I think of the holocaust and the effect it had on the survivors, their families and those who stood by and did nothing until it was too late.

DISCUSS: Joseph Andrew Stack Manifesto Transcript?

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